From bmanning@ISI.EDU Tue Feb 4 13:09:03 2003 From: bmanning@ISI.EDU (Bill Manning) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 05:09:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [vet-DS] workshops In-Reply-To: <200301152143.h0FLhqk29676@boreas.isi.edu> from Bill Manning at "Jan 15, 3 01:43:52 pm" Message-ID: <200302041309.h14D93k19711@boreas.isi.edu> % 1) I've put in for a room, in venue, for 13-15 march % 2) what... kind of depends on the fate of DS, but I expect % to try and nail down participants that are willing to % do more with the persistant v6 testbed. If so, much % can be done prior to the actual mtg. % 3) before... (I'm expecting to be coming back from Oz on the % 12th) Bad news. The Hyatt has sold out its 56 breakout rooms on the 14th/15th (seems others are willing to pay more :( we can move to another hotel adjacent to the Hyatt or find another venue, or we can cancel this effort. comments/suggestions? --bill Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). From edlewis@arin.net Tue Feb 4 13:24:34 2003 From: edlewis@arin.net (Edward Lewis) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 08:24:34 -0500 Subject: [vet-DS] workshops In-Reply-To: <200302041309.h14D93k19711@boreas.isi.edu> References: <200302041309.h14D93k19711@boreas.isi.edu> Message-ID: What about Redwood City (or some other outlying location reasonably close to SF)? Much, *much*, cheaper all around, and there'll be a raft of folks transferring to the IETF so no one will get lost on the way up there at the end of the event. At 5:09 -0800 2/4/03, Bill Manning wrote: >% 1) I've put in for a room, in venue, for 13-15 march >% 2) what... kind of depends on the fate of DS, but I expect >% to try and nail down participants that are willing to >% do more with the persistant v6 testbed. If so, much >% can be done prior to the actual mtg. >% 3) before... (I'm expecting to be coming back from Oz on the >% 12th) > > Bad news. The Hyatt has sold out its 56 breakout rooms on > the 14th/15th (seems others are willing to pay more :( > > we can move to another hotel adjacent to the Hyatt or > find another venue, or we can cancel this effort. > > comments/suggestions? > > >--bill >Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and >certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-703-227-9854 ARIN Research Engineer From bmanning@ISI.EDU Tue Feb 4 14:29:16 2003 From: bmanning@ISI.EDU (Bill Manning) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 06:29:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [vet-DS] workshops In-Reply-To: from Edward Lewis at "Feb 4, 3 08:24:34 am" Message-ID: <200302041429.h14ETGY06484@boreas.isi.edu> fine by me. any one care to volunteer a venue? % What about Redwood City (or some other outlying location reasonably % close to SF)? Much, *much*, cheaper all around, and there'll be a % raft of folks transferring to the IETF so no one will get lost on the % way up there at the end of the event. % % At 5:09 -0800 2/4/03, Bill Manning wrote: % >% 1) I've put in for a room, in venue, for 13-15 march % >% 2) what... kind of depends on the fate of DS, but I expect % >% to try and nail down participants that are willing to % >% do more with the persistant v6 testbed. If so, much % >% can be done prior to the actual mtg. % >% 3) before... (I'm expecting to be coming back from Oz on the % >% 12th) % > % > Bad news. The Hyatt has sold out its 56 breakout rooms on % > the 14th/15th (seems others are willing to pay more :( % > % > we can move to another hotel adjacent to the Hyatt or % > find another venue, or we can cancel this effort. % > % > comments/suggestions? % > % > % >--bill % >Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and % >certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). % % -- % -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- % Edward Lewis +1-703-227-9854 % ARIN Research Engineer % -- --bill Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). From hugh@xisp.net Tue Feb 4 20:15:46 2003 From: hugh@xisp.net (Hugh Daniel) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 12:15:46 -0800 Subject: [vet-DS] workshops In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 04 Feb 2003 05:09:03 PST." <200302041309.h14D93k19711@boreas.isi.edu> Message-ID: <200302042016.h14KGEl31373@road.toad.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- First off it's the Hiltion as pointed out. I think we can provide IP from the IETF networking, I am still working on that, but if we are not in that venue we loose. How many people are we planning on? How many have expressed interest? ||ugh -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3ia Charset: noconv Comment: For the matching public key, finger the Reply-To: address. iQCVAwUBPkAfWVZpdJR7FBQRAQF16gP/TfPGWd1KDUyeB9tBovm5GnwLgKo3E31k 8bgUJ1Ru98WIWbpf7rYL/Zzi1gb16d03ZpyB91YcXX1VUkNeLX74LJBUY6gMLsar futhcWyz+mRWHsluqqifHdRSelQQcAqaZfP3Coj1QH8zkhNG0zr6k8peUPHcvMOe Hvzx/2xo4M8= =HvoH -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From olaf@ripe.net Wed Feb 5 08:22:37 2003 From: olaf@ripe.net (Olaf M. Kolkman) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 09:22:37 +0100 Subject: [vet-DS] workshops In-Reply-To: <200302042016.h14KGEl31373@road.toad.com> References: <200302041309.h14D93k19711@boreas.isi.edu> <200302042016.h14KGEl31373@road.toad.com> Message-ID: <20030205092237.44450d72.olaf@ripe.net> > > How many people are we planning on? How many have expressed > interest? > You can count on me... ticket is booked and all.. --Olaf --------------------------------------------| Olaf M. Kolkman | www.ripe.net/disi From rnspayne@the-paynes.com Wed Feb 5 13:40:42 2003 From: rnspayne@the-paynes.com (Rob Payne) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 08:40:42 -0500 Subject: [vet-DS] workshops In-Reply-To: <20030205092237.44450d72.olaf@ripe.net> References: <200302041309.h14D93k19711@boreas.isi.edu> <200302042016.h14KGEl31373@road.toad.com> <20030205092237.44450d72.olaf@ripe.net> Message-ID: <20030205134042.GE13165@osprey.the-paynes.com> --rHXT7wjifYJhd5Y1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline On Wed, Feb 05, 2003 at 09:22:37AM +0100, Olaf M. Kolkman wrote: Hugh> How many people are we planning on? How many have expressed Hugh> interest? Olaf> You can count on me... ticket is booked and all.. Count me in, and one other person from 'round here. Reservations were made, they can change if venue moves far enough. ;D -rob --rHXT7wjifYJhd5Y1 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+QRRaOVBTTvic5hMRAksiAKDkyvac858GSftkWAGo3HRRx9DWrwCgr4xx sa+WRCt5DVX+FllI0bAw9T4= =MkX2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --rHXT7wjifYJhd5Y1-- From bmanning@ISI.EDU Wed Feb 5 18:12:01 2003 From: bmanning@ISI.EDU (Bill Manning) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 10:12:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: [vet-DS] workshops In-Reply-To: <200302042016.h14KGEl31373@road.toad.com> from Hugh Daniel at "Feb 4, 3 12:15:46 pm" Message-ID: <200302051812.h15IC1s26014@boreas.isi.edu> % First off it's the Hiltion as pointed out. I think we can provide % IP from the IETF networking, I am still working on that, but if we are % not in that venue we loose. toast. % How many people are we planning on? How many have expressed % interest? no made any public announcement yet. currently looks like ~8-10. --bill Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). From edlewis@arin.net Wed Feb 5 22:20:04 2003 From: edlewis@arin.net (Edward Lewis) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 14:20:04 -0800 Subject: [vet-DS] workshops In-Reply-To: <200302042016.h14KGEl31373@road.toad.com> References: <200302042016.h14KGEl31373@road.toad.com> Message-ID: At 12:15 -0800 2/4/03, Hugh Daniel wrote: > How many people are we planning on? How many have expressed >interest? I'll be in the SF bay area. I don't have a room in SF until Sunday night of IETF, I have one in RWC before that. I'm not clear on whether the talk is of still trying to get into a downtown facility or one nearer an airport... -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-703-227-9854 ARIN Research Engineer From hugh@xisp.net Thu Feb 6 02:09:27 2003 From: hugh@xisp.net (Hugh Daniel) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 18:09:27 -0800 Subject: [vet-DS] workshops In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 05 Feb 2003 14:20:04 PST." Message-ID: <200302060209.h1629SY27507@road.toad.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Ed, the best thing would be for us to be in the Hotel (Hilton) as that is where we should be able to get IP (from the IETF networking comming up a bit early, I am working on that). Next would be some place else in the city or failing that the Bay Area. If the group is small enough I might host it at either my lab (Santa Cruz Mountains) or another house with T1 in San Francisco. Both are small though and realistically can't work for more then maybe 12 or 16 folks, if that. But both will have T1 lines and are fun, but it would be MUCH better to be at the hotel. We are currently looking at getting a Suite room in the hilton, but that is $700 per day and seems to hold only about 10 folks. So it will happen, the question is where. ||ugh -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3ia Charset: noconv Comment: For the matching public key, finger the Reply-To: address. iQCVAwUBPkHD1VZpdJR7FBQRAQEocQQAxO01ZlUL7mvrvbipjUdUWMwpBStvKdYX bBvqRz+8WAnNHBSmRKEcIOhx2I8lVtNoHWdOQ4OTkf1Gg08pwNkxTMmNSzNv5AZC VlB6IbhBQHik2bN8ZWs8Cc4kQNt0VIsKKYch+eQd5CKftBm3W/Gk6dxIlia2ERjw 1Js0m4WOlSo= =ZMso -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From mcr@sandelman.ottawa.on.ca Thu Feb 6 02:55:40 2003 From: mcr@sandelman.ottawa.on.ca (Michael Richardson) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 21:55:40 -0500 Subject: [vet-DS] workshops In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 05 Feb 2003 14:20:04 PST." Message-ID: <200302060255.h162teE2012816@marajade.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >>>>> "Edward" == Edward Lewis writes: Edward> At 12:15 -0800 2/4/03, Hugh Daniel wrote: >> How many people are we planning on? How many have expressed interest? Edward> I'll be in the SF bay area. I don't have a room in SF until Edward> Sunday night of IETF, I have one in RWC before that. Edward> I'm not clear on whether the talk is of still trying to get into Edward> a downtown facility or one nearer an airport... -- I called the Hotel as well as Bill. We can get space for 10 people for about $2K. It will either be on the IETF network, or they'll get us IP another way (for a fee). Someone could actually sleep in this suite... Maybe Ed! pro: in the hotel. we can work as late as want. The room is actually a 2pm to noon affair, so if we get it Thur. afternoon and keep it until Sat... con: not cheap. IETF hotel not cheap to stay in. We could go somewhere else. I don't see any advantage of doing "across the street", unless they have good quality IP. So, we might as well go where there is IP. If that is a shinny Cisco building in Milpitas, fine. i.e. whatever. (I spent a 4th of July in the hotel across the street, and watched them put up half of that building one summer...) Hey, let's camp out at isc.org, in front of F. ("All hail the root name servers") ] ON HUMILITY: to err is human. To moo, bovine. | firewalls [ ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works, Ottawa, ON |net architect[ ] mcr@sandelman.ottawa.on.ca http://www.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca/ |device driver[ ] panic("Just another Debian GNU/Linux using, kernel hacking, security guy"); [ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Finger me for keys iQCVAwUBPkHOqoqHRg3pndX9AQEJ6QQAod0E9+VOzypvRqL4vCKpET5um78Sxz5H nieHSMKWi3nNNa64m8qlSC7e4PqUypU6k7AXuRYZAG9HeqwIpeCa7mdBSvGh9uIs bJjDst000xI80xjXbHrDcq+yUUSgWgnvUo3qJ44HyPiTHxg+pE0s39SYntdVECzp A6vADO5vCho= =pUUg -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From scottr@nist.gov Thu Feb 6 12:36:44 2003 From: scottr@nist.gov (Scott Rose) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 07:36:44 -0500 Subject: [vet-DS] workshops References: <200302060255.h162teE2012816@marajade.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca> Message-ID: <00ad01c2cddc$68128aa0$b9370681@barnacle> Hate to ask this again: but what days are we planning for? The week before or week after IETF? Hopefully NIST will have a %*#$ budget by then, and I can actually travel. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Richardson" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 9:55 PM Subject: Re: [vet-DS] workshops > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > > > >>>>> "Edward" == Edward Lewis writes: > Edward> At 12:15 -0800 2/4/03, Hugh Daniel wrote: > >> How many people are we planning on? How many have expressed interest? > > Edward> I'll be in the SF bay area. I don't have a room in SF until > Edward> Sunday night of IETF, I have one in RWC before that. > > Edward> I'm not clear on whether the talk is of still trying to get into > Edward> a downtown facility or one nearer an airport... -- > > I called the Hotel as well as Bill. > We can get space for 10 people for about $2K. It will either be on the > IETF network, or they'll get us IP another way (for a fee). Someone could > actually sleep in this suite... Maybe Ed! > > pro: in the hotel. we can work as late as want. The room is actually > a 2pm to noon affair, so if we get it Thur. afternoon and keep it > until Sat... > > con: not cheap. IETF hotel not cheap to stay in. > > We could go somewhere else. I don't see any advantage of doing "across the > street", unless they have good quality IP. So, we might as well go where > there is IP. If that is a shinny Cisco building in Milpitas, > fine. i.e. whatever. > (I spent a 4th of July in the hotel across the street, and watched them put > up half of that building one summer...) > > Hey, let's camp out at isc.org, in front of F. > ("All hail the root name servers") > > ] ON HUMILITY: to err is human. To moo, bovine. | firewalls [ > ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works, Ottawa, ON |net architect[ > ] mcr@sandelman.ottawa.on.ca http://www.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca/ |device driver[ > ] panic("Just another Debian GNU/Linux using, kernel hacking, security guy"); [ > > > > > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux) > Comment: Finger me for keys > > iQCVAwUBPkHOqoqHRg3pndX9AQEJ6QQAod0E9+VOzypvRqL4vCKpET5um78Sxz5H > nieHSMKWi3nNNa64m8qlSC7e4PqUypU6k7AXuRYZAG9HeqwIpeCa7mdBSvGh9uIs > bJjDst000xI80xjXbHrDcq+yUUSgWgnvUo3qJ44HyPiTHxg+pE0s39SYntdVECzp > A6vADO5vCho= > =pUUg > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From bmanning@ISI.EDU Thu Feb 6 18:21:39 2003 From: bmanning@ISI.EDU (Bill Manning) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:21:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [vet-DS] new venue offering? Message-ID: <200302061821.h16ILdM27016@boreas.isi.edu> We have been offered space at ISC (950 Charter) if we can work out the agenda and there are no objections. Comments? --bill Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). From edlewis@arin.net Thu Feb 6 20:03:38 2003 From: edlewis@arin.net (Edward Lewis) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 12:03:38 -0800 Subject: [vet-DS] new venue offering? In-Reply-To: <200302061821.h16ILdM27016@boreas.isi.edu> References: <200302061821.h16ILdM27016@boreas.isi.edu> Message-ID: For those staying in SF, there's CalTrain to Redwood City. Picking up and dropping off folks could be arranged (I'll have a rental car and motel room convenient to do this.) Or if folks are concerned about transferring from a hotel in RWC to SF on the Sunday of IETF, I can arrange to shuttle folks and luggage in the morning before I turn my car in. At 10:21 -0800 2/6/03, Bill Manning wrote: > We have been offered space at ISC (950 Charter) > if we can work out the agenda and there are no > objections. > > Comments? > > >--bill >Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and >certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-703-227-9854 ARIN Research Engineer From bmanning@ISI.EDU Wed Feb 12 19:54:18 2003 From: bmanning@ISI.EDU (Bill Manning) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 11:54:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED Message-ID: <200302121954.h1CJsIo09287@boreas.isi.edu> Sorry folks, I know this is -VERY- short notice, but it can't be helped. I am in the difficult position of having travel suspended until further notice. That, combined with the difficulty in locking down a venue for the workshop leads me to pass the token for planning/conducting a workshop to others - at least for the nonce. (Hugh, we can still nail down the bits needed to perform SEC tricks during the IETF, I just can't be there. :( --bill Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). From rnspayne@the-paynes.com Wed Feb 12 20:39:04 2003 From: rnspayne@the-paynes.com (Rob Payne) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 15:39:04 -0500 Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: <200302121954.h1CJsIo09287@boreas.isi.edu> References: <200302121954.h1CJsIo09287@boreas.isi.edu> Message-ID: <20030212203904.GK2242@osprey.the-paynes.com> --0kRkyLZR5zsR9u2P Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Feb 12, 2003 at 11:54:18AM -0800, Bill Manning wrote: > Sorry folks, I know this is -VERY- short notice, but it can't be helped. > I am in the difficult position of having travel suspended until further= =20 > notice. Short notice is better than no notice! Thanks for getting us this far, Bill. =20 > That, combined with the difficulty in locking down a venue for the worksh= op > leads me to pass the token for planning/conducting a workshop to others -= at > least for the nonce. The last I heard was that ISC had offered space at 950 Charter, for the workshop. Is that still the case? I am still planning to come, unless we decide soon that it's not going to happen. I am happy to assist with planning, if that is possible from the opposite (wrong?) coast, if this workshop is still viable. How many people are currently planning to be in SF for the workshop? My unofficial count of the people who responded to the list is: Olaf Hugh? MRC Ed Scott R(?) David P. (not on the list, planning on attending from here) Me Is that everyone? Is there anyone from ISC planning on taking part? Are any of the people who are still planning on coming, up for conducting the workshop? Does anyone have agenda suggestions? There were items left over from the workshop goals from Atlanta, but probably not enough to fill this workshop. How about building a reproducible configuration that can be used again at other workshops? -rob, ASOC (Apparently Spontaneous Obsessive Compulsive) --0kRkyLZR5zsR9u2P Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+SrDoOVBTTvic5hMRAkB3AKCZ2olKPejnfKJKFPG5EyWsz2m9uQCgiyy8 D5oadrs4uVzIl3v2Zup9Gkw= =7PWM -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --0kRkyLZR5zsR9u2P-- From yasuhiro@jprs.co.jp Thu Feb 13 02:04:40 2003 From: yasuhiro@jprs.co.jp (Yasuhiro Morishita / =?iso-2022-jp?B?GyRCPzkyPEJZOSgbKEI=?=) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:04:40 +0900 (JST) Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: <20030212203904.GK2242@osprey.the-paynes.com> References: <200302121954.h1CJsIo09287@boreas.isi.edu> <20030212203904.GK2242@osprey.the-paynes.com> Message-ID: <20030213.110440.01450883.yasuhiro@jprs.co.jp> Hello, this is Yasuhiro 'Orange' Morishita @ JPRS (Registry of .JP). > I am happy to assist with planning, if that is possible from the > opposite (wrong?) coast, if this workshop is still viable. How many > people are currently planning to be in SF for the workshop? My > unofficial count of the people who responded to the list is: > > Olaf > Hugh? > MRC > Ed > Scott R(?) > David P. (not on the list, planning on attending from here) > Me > > Is that everyone? Fujiwara-san and I(Y. 'Orange' Morishita) are planning to attend for the workshop. Please add the list. In previous workshop, Sekiya-san @ WIDE Project (sekiya@sfc.wide.ad.jp) participated, it may also participate this time. Regards, -- Yasuhiro 'Orange' Morishita, Research and Development department Japan Registry Service Co.,Ltd. (JPRS) E-Mail: yasuhiro@jprs.co.jp From sanz@denic.de Thu Feb 13 09:28:13 2003 From: sanz@denic.de (Marcos Sanz/Denic) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 10:28:13 +0100 Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED Message-ID: On 13.02.2003 03:04 Yasuhiro Morishita / 森下泰宏 wrote: > > > Is that everyone? I am sorry that I can't attend because I am in holidays in March. Pity. Regards, Marcos Sanz From Sam Weiler Thu Feb 13 17:26:27 2003 From: Sam Weiler (Sam Weiler) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:26:27 -0500 (EST) Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: <20030212203904.GK2242@osprey.the-paynes.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, Rob Payne wrote: > Is that everyone? Is there anyone from ISC planning on taking part? I plan to attend, and I think Wes Griffin will, too. > Are any of the people who are still planning on coming, up for > conducting the workshop? I'd be happy to volunteer. -- Sam From scottr@nist.gov Fri Feb 14 16:09:45 2003 From: scottr@nist.gov (Scott Rose) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 11:09:45 -0500 Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED References: Message-ID: <003101c2d443$7dae0890$b9370681@barnacle> I don't think I will be able to attend either. Travel budget restrictions and whatnot. I will attend IETF, but the workshop will be a no-go for me. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marcos Sanz/Denic" To: Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 4:28 AM Subject: Re: Re: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED > On 13.02.2003 03:04 Yasuhiro Morishita / 森下泰宏 wrote: > > > > > Is that everyone? > > I am sorry that I can't attend because I am in holidays in March. > Pity. > > Regards, > Marcos Sanz > From edlewis@arin.net Fri Feb 14 16:58:37 2003 From: edlewis@arin.net (Edward Lewis) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 11:58:37 -0500 Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: <20030212203904.GK2242@osprey.the-paynes.com> References: <200302121954.h1CJsIo09287@boreas.isi.edu> <20030212203904.GK2242@osprey.the-paynes.com> Message-ID: I have heard that the event will be at the ISC building. If no one from ISC is participating, we'll congregate in the parking lot and leech wireless from them. (;)). Note that I've only heard that this news, Paul/Suzanne/et.al. might overrule. I hope that we'll have a good 'nuff testable code base by then, with whatever changes are suggested to make DS not be a problem. That'll dictate the agenda. As far as a set up plan, I think that will be easy to set up. I like the one I used in October for the ARIN workshop (four IP's per machine) - Rob, you were there I think. Other than that, I'll defer thinking about it until after the APRICOT tutorials (I leave tomorrow). At 15:39 -0500 2/12/03, Rob Payne wrote: >On Wed, Feb 12, 2003 at 11:54:18AM -0800, Bill Manning wrote: >> Sorry folks, I know this is -VERY- short notice, but it can't be helped. >> I am in the difficult position of having travel suspended until further >> notice. > >Short notice is better than no notice! Thanks for getting us this >far, Bill. > >> That, combined with the difficulty in locking down a venue for the workshop >> leads me to pass the token for planning/conducting a workshop to others - at >> least for the nonce. > >The last I heard was that ISC had offered space at 950 Charter, for >the workshop. Is that still the case? I am still planning to come, >unless we decide soon that it's not going to happen. > >I am happy to assist with planning, if that is possible from the >opposite (wrong?) coast, if this workshop is still viable. How many >people are currently planning to be in SF for the workshop? My >unofficial count of the people who responded to the list is: > >Olaf >Hugh? >MRC >Ed >Scott R(?) >David P. (not on the list, planning on attending from here) >Me > >Is that everyone? Is there anyone from ISC planning on taking part? >Are any of the people who are still planning on coming, up for >conducting the workshop? > >Does anyone have agenda suggestions? There were items left over from >the workshop goals from Atlanta, but probably not enough to fill this >workshop. How about building a reproducible configuration that can be >used again at other workshops? > > -rob, ASOC > >(Apparently Spontaneous Obsessive Compulsive) > > > -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-703-227-9854 ARIN Research Engineer From bmanning@ISI.EDU Fri Feb 14 18:16:49 2003 From: bmanning@ISI.EDU (Bill Manning) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 10:16:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: from Edward Lewis at "Feb 14, 3 11:58:37 am" Message-ID: <200302141816.h1EIGnE16563@boreas.isi.edu> ISC folks are on this list... Perhaps they can confirm their participation. :) % I have heard that the event will be at the ISC building. If no one % from ISC is participating, we'll congregate in the parking lot and % leech wireless from them. (;)). Note that I've only heard that this % news, Paul/Suzanne/et.al. might overrule. % % I hope that we'll have a good 'nuff testable code base by then, with % whatever changes are suggested to make DS not be a problem. That'll % dictate the agenda. % % As far as a set up plan, I think that will be easy to set up. I like % the one I used in October for the ARIN workshop (four IP's per % machine) - Rob, you were there I think. Other than that, I'll defer % thinking about it until after the APRICOT tutorials (I leave % tomorrow). % % At 15:39 -0500 2/12/03, Rob Payne wrote: % >On Wed, Feb 12, 2003 at 11:54:18AM -0800, Bill Manning wrote: % >> Sorry folks, I know this is -VERY- short notice, but it can't be helped. % >> I am in the difficult position of having travel suspended until further % >> notice. % > % >Short notice is better than no notice! Thanks for getting us this % >far, Bill. % > % >> That, combined with the difficulty in locking down a venue for the workshop % >> leads me to pass the token for planning/conducting a workshop to others - at % >> least for the nonce. % > % >The last I heard was that ISC had offered space at 950 Charter, for % >the workshop. Is that still the case? I am still planning to come, % >unless we decide soon that it's not going to happen. % > % >I am happy to assist with planning, if that is possible from the % >opposite (wrong?) coast, if this workshop is still viable. How many % >people are currently planning to be in SF for the workshop? My % >unofficial count of the people who responded to the list is: % > % >Olaf % >Hugh? % >MRC % >Ed % >Scott R(?) % >David P. (not on the list, planning on attending from here) % >Me % > % >Is that everyone? Is there anyone from ISC planning on taking part? % >Are any of the people who are still planning on coming, up for % >conducting the workshop? % > % >Does anyone have agenda suggestions? There were items left over from % >the workshop goals from Atlanta, but probably not enough to fill this % >workshop. How about building a reproducible configuration that can be % >used again at other workshops? % > % > -rob, ASOC % > % >(Apparently Spontaneous Obsessive Compulsive) % > % > % > % % % % -- % -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- % Edward Lewis +1-703-227-9854 % ARIN Research Engineer % -- --bill Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). From Suzanne_Woolf@isc.org Fri Feb 14 19:39:42 2003 From: Suzanne_Woolf@isc.org (Suzanne Woolf) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 19:39:42 +0000 Subject: pre-IETF workshop was Re: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: References: <200302121954.h1CJsIo09287@boreas.isi.edu> <20030212203904.GK2242@osprey.the-paynes.com> Message-ID: <20030214193942.GA35856@farside.isc.org> ISC had offered assistance to Bill with a venue for a pre-IETF workshop before his travel woes appeared. We're still offering. Our on-site space is limited to 15 participants. I've asked Bill for any agenda notes he already had, and will be happy to work with him, Ed, and other participants on an agenda. On Fri, Feb 14, 2003 at 11:58:37AM -0500, Edward Lewis wrote: > I hope that we'll have a good 'nuff testable code base by then, with > whatever changes are suggested to make DS not be a problem. That'll > dictate the agenda. Fair enough and we can refine this over the next little while. The potential DS changes need to include experiment for a significant variety of cases. Any remaining goals from other workshops should also be brought up. > As far as a set up plan, I think that will be easy to set up. I like > the one I used in October for the ARIN workshop (four IP's per > machine) - Rob, you were there I think. I was also at Ed's ARIN workshop and still have the notes, it's a perfectly reasonable place to start. > >Does anyone have agenda suggestions? There were items left over from > >the workshop goals from Atlanta, but probably not enough to fill this > >workshop. How about building a reproducible configuration that can be > >used again at other workshops? Reproducible configuration is something every workshop seems to decide is needed, so let's Just Do It. From bmanning@ISI.EDU Fri Feb 14 22:00:02 2003 From: bmanning@ISI.EDU (Bill Manning) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 14:00:02 -0800 (PST) Subject: pre-IETF workshop was Re: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: <20030214193942.GA35856@farside.isc.org> from Suzanne Woolf at "Feb 14, 3 07:39:42 pm" Message-ID: <200302142200.h1EM03A13935@boreas.isi.edu> ok... the premise for ATL and then for this ws had less to do with protocol development and more with the chance to invite users (and intended users) of this technology to have a semi-controlled venue for experimentation and exposure to this goofy technology. now I know that the code base is still "fluid" and the spec still has a ways to go in the standards process, but that does not preclue getting more people exposed to the ramifications of how this stuff might be made to work. a driver was that most ws were closed, with specific invitees and tight deliverables. I was intending to have more open environments that anyone could join. however, others will have to set the agenda for this ws. note that this list is open subscription, so if a targeted ws is desired, this list may not be the place to plan it. :) % % ISC had offered assistance to Bill with a venue for a pre-IETF % workshop before his travel woes appeared. We're still offering. Our % on-site space is limited to 15 participants. % % I've asked Bill for any agenda notes he already had, and will be happy % to work with him, Ed, and other participants on an agenda. % % On Fri, Feb 14, 2003 at 11:58:37AM -0500, Edward Lewis wrote: % > I hope that we'll have a good 'nuff testable code base by then, with % > whatever changes are suggested to make DS not be a problem. That'll % > dictate the agenda. % % Fair enough and we can refine this over the next little while. The % potential DS changes need to include experiment for a significant % variety of cases. Any remaining goals from other workshops should also % be brought up. % % > As far as a set up plan, I think that will be easy to set up. I like % > the one I used in October for the ARIN workshop (four IP's per % > machine) - Rob, you were there I think. % % I was also at Ed's ARIN workshop and still have the notes, it's a % perfectly reasonable place to start. % % > >Does anyone have agenda suggestions? There were items left over from % > >the workshop goals from Atlanta, but probably not enough to fill this % > >workshop. How about building a reproducible configuration that can be % > >used again at other workshops? % % Reproducible configuration is something every workshop seems to decide % is needed, so let's Just Do It. % -- --bill Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). From mcr@sandelman.ottawa.on.ca Sat Feb 15 17:27:12 2003 From: mcr@sandelman.ottawa.on.ca (Michael Richardson) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 12:27:12 -0500 Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 12 Feb 2003 15:39:04 EST." <20030212203904.GK2242@osprey.the-paynes.com> Message-ID: <200302151727.h1FHRD2t023233@marajade.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >>>>> "Rob" == Rob Payne writes: Rob> I am happy to assist with planning, if that is possible from the Rob> opposite (wrong?) coast, if this workshop is still viable. How many Rob> people are currently planning to be in SF for the workshop? My Rob> unofficial count of the people who responded to the list is: Rob> Olaf Rob> Hugh? Rob> MRC MCR, yes. Rob> Does anyone have agenda suggestions? There were items left over from Rob> the workshop goals from Atlanta, but probably not enough to fill this Rob> workshop. How about building a reproducible configuration that can be Rob> used again at other workshops? Yes. We need to do exactly that. I'd like to additionally have: a) an experimental, signed root that is visible on the network. b) a signed arpa. c) some other zones, including another root, that we can publish the private keys for. ] ON HUMILITY: to err is human. To moo, bovine. | firewalls [ ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works, Ottawa, ON |net architect[ ] mcr@sandelman.ottawa.on.ca http://www.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca/ |device driver[ ] panic("Just another Debian GNU/Linux using, kernel hacking, security guy"); [ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Finger me for keys iQCVAwUBPk54bYqHRg3pndX9AQE2lQP/X0OArU0mdMAM/3z3u++jcRDJKQtb4ffQ N7ivAPEpQMy2zRv7UvoQIFhfKp8xp9fC1xCPYGFuGwQRYp1gTzOxlhYbmEHX8YXb jL158+hpRzNct3uW6F1X1ck8FSfmK05KZHTsFPBJmFaBJk6U//ZhQRpHQKPU0P54 w4dF5UW9XNY= =AZIJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From bmanning@ISI.EDU Tue Feb 18 00:00:51 2003 From: bmanning@ISI.EDU (Bill Manning) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 16:00:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: <200302151727.h1FHRD2t023233@marajade.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca> from Michael Richardson at "Feb 15, 3 12:27:12 pm" Message-ID: <200302180000.h1I00p200459@boreas.isi.edu> % Yes. We need to do exactly that. % I'd like to additionally have: % a) an experimental, signed root that is visible on the network. % b) a signed arpa. % c) some other zones, including another root, that we can % publish the private keys for. % Please explain c) what do you mean by "another root"? For the rest of your points, they are already done, e.g. www.rs.net --bill Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). From mcr@cyphermail.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca Tue Feb 18 06:54:33 2003 From: mcr@cyphermail.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca (Michael Richardson) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 01:54:33 -0500 Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 17 Feb 2003 16:00:51 PST." <200302180000.h1I00p200459@boreas.isi.edu> Message-ID: <200302180654.h1I6sY09008950@marajade.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >>>>> "Bill" == Bill Manning writes: Bill> % Yes. We need to do exactly that. % I'd like to additionally Bill> have: % a) an experimental, signed root that is visible on the Bill> network. % b) a signed arpa. % c) some other zones, including Bill> another root, that we can % publish the private keys for. % Bill> Please explain c) what do you mean by "another root"? I would like to have a set of files, including private keys for a root name server. This is so that people setting up private test beds do not have to invent the wheel each time. If we have setup an experimental root that is "live", then I do not think that you want to publish the private key. Grabbing all of the data, and doing it again with an expendable key is what (c) is about. Bill> For the rest of your points, they are already done, e.g. Bill> www.rs.net Yes. But, getting good enough v6 connectivity seems to be a stumbling point for some. I didn't know about the web page. I will do the right thing with my zones and my laptop in the next days. ] ON HUMILITY: to err is human. To moo, bovine. | firewalls [ ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works, Ottawa, ON |net architect[ ] mcr@sandelman.ottawa.on.ca http://www.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca/ |device driver[ ] panic("Just another Debian GNU/Linux using, kernel hacking, security guy"); [ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Finger me for keys iQCVAwUBPlHYqIqHRg3pndX9AQGUuQQA0kiNusHmazq0lqa0H37XmUFZnTfyVX3R uicGtQ223L0M21Vms5Ujs3q7uJ8WreoyoFvj222HS1hZZm1rIvIq7+SSzWGiClGS 1bOtT1r51+qNa9zX01/RXFc69L4H/9V86Regl3aNBQK0fdMNU1oNanzn8btCfywj tvo2suoa6tI= =xMry -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From bmanning@ISI.EDU Sat Feb 22 11:00:42 2003 From: bmanning@ISI.EDU (Bill Manning) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 03:00:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: <200302180654.h1I6sY09008950@marajade.sandelman.ottawa.on.ca> from Michael Richardson at "Feb 18, 3 01:54:33 am" Message-ID: <200302221100.h1MB0gY29667@boreas.isi.edu> % Bill> For the rest of your points, they are already done, e.g. % Bill> www.rs.net % % Yes. But, getting good enough v6 connectivity seems to be a stumbling % point for some. price of admission. :) looks like we will be back to dual stack in the testbed for a while anyway. --bill Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). From Suzanne_Woolf@isc.org Fri Feb 28 19:49:20 2003 From: Suzanne_Woolf@isc.org (Suzanne Woolf) Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 19:49:20 +0000 Subject: pre-IETF workshop was Re: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: <200302142200.h1EM03A13935@boreas.isi.edu> References: <20030214193942.GA35856@farside.isc.org> <200302142200.h1EM03A13935@boreas.isi.edu> Message-ID: <20030228194920.GA38048@farside.isc.org> After some discussion it appears we've got two sets of issues for a workshop. 1) Known issues, additional test of features that have been under consideration and development for some time, including those in delegation-signer-12 and known key management issues. This also includes a request to spend some time on review of the recent DNSSEC drafts and provide feedback to the working group. 2) Discussion/consideration/test of more recent issues and potential fixes. This includes the problem with legacy resolvers misinterpreting the presence of NXT in a DS referral, and attempts to uncover other corner cases in the current protocol not yet considered. Agenda items so far: * further test of opt-in and DS-12 changes (interoperability with legacy software) * document review for the WG * further experiment with possible fixes to the "NXT in legacy resolvers" problem * a set of zones and scripts that can be used as a baseline for setting up future workshops and maintaining consistency in test setups. At this point we're looking for: * additional agenda items * a couple of folks to help plan and set up tasks/tests We're setting aside Wednesday (March 12) and Thursday (March 13), with Friday (March 14) if needed for this activity. It's been suggested that we consider splitting into two groups, in order to cover more ground under both topics, but that depends on participants. Please rsvp if interested, with a few words about what tests/issues interest you most, so we'll know about how many people to expect and can start planning tasks. thanks, Suzanne On Fri, Feb 14, 2003 at 02:00:02PM -0800, Bill Manning wrote: > % ISC had offered assistance to Bill with a venue for a pre-IETF > % workshop before his travel woes appeared. We're still offering. Our > % on-site space is limited to 15 participants. > % > % I've asked Bill for any agenda notes he already had, and will be happy > % to work with him, Ed, and other participants on an agenda. > > ok... the premise for ATL and then for this ws had less to do > with protocol development and more with the chance to invite > users (and intended users) of this technology to have a semi-controlled > venue for experimentation and exposure to this goofy technology. > > now I know that the code base is still "fluid" and the spec still > has a ways to go in the standards process, but that does not preclue > getting more people exposed to the ramifications of how this stuff > might be made to work. > From rnspayne@the-paynes.com Fri Feb 28 21:27:05 2003 From: rnspayne@the-paynes.com (Rob Payne) Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 16:27:05 -0500 Subject: pre-IETF workshop was Re: [vet-DS] TRAVEL SUSPENDED In-Reply-To: <20030228194920.GA38048@farside.isc.org> References: <20030214193942.GA35856@farside.isc.org> <200302142200.h1EM03A13935@boreas.isi.edu> <20030228194920.GA38048@farside.isc.org> Message-ID: <20030228212705.GH20638@osprey.the-paynes.com> --gKijDXBCEH69PxaN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Feb 28, 2003 at 07:49:20PM +0000, Suzanne Woolf wrote: >=20 > After some discussion it appears we've got two sets of issues for a > workshop. >=20 > 1) Known issues, additional test of features that have been under > consideration and development for some time, including those in > delegation-signer-12 and known key management issues. This also > includes a request to spend some time on review of the recent DNSSEC > drafts and provide feedback to the working group. >=20 > 2) Discussion/consideration/test of more recent issues and potential > fixes. This includes the problem with legacy resolvers misinterpreting > the presence of NXT in a DS referral, and attempts to uncover other > corner cases in the current protocol not yet considered. >=20 > Agenda items so far: > * further test of opt-in and DS-12 changes (interoperability with=20 > legacy software) > * document review for the WG > * further experiment with possible fixes to the "NXT in legacy=20 > resolvers" problem > * a set of zones and scripts that can be used as a baseline for=20 > setting up future workshops and maintaining consistency in test= =20 > setups. >=20 > At this point we're looking for: > * additional agenda items > * a couple of folks to help plan and set up tasks/tests >=20 > We're setting aside Wednesday (March 12) and Thursday (March 13), with > Friday (March 14) if needed for this activity. It's been suggested > that we consider splitting into two groups, in order to cover more > ground under both topics, but that depends on participants. > =09 > Please rsvp if interested, with a few words about what tests/issues > interest you most, so we'll know about how many people to expect and > can start planning tasks. I mentioned a key-signing to Suzanne to make sure that more of us have a web o' trust to verify the software which is being used to do the DNSSEC verfications in a previous message. I have the following list of 'left overs' from my notes on the ATL workshop, it might be a starting point for our discussion: v6 DNAME VP & cache persistence KRoll / Embedded keys Child KSK Roll Root KSK Roll clear path clarification OE test verify grandparent/child problems DSniff/dnsspoof verify assumptions * testing beat on it break a key - how to tell? - who to tell? local "api" discussion deployment issues opt-in timing dependencies wildcard testing secure dynamic updates That was the list of tests that we had enumerated in ATL. Some of them were tested, some of them were not at all, some may have only gotten a little coverage. -rob --gKijDXBCEH69PxaN Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+X9QpOVBTTvic5hMRAi2kAKDsgq5Jl4CNB+GBbg9hySMd3yyFmQCg3Qdb gQQKFqTSD9SdEjEPDwd3AJU= =ZKUv -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --gKijDXBCEH69PxaN--